Tim Ormond on January 15, 2008 said:

I just got an instant message from my friend Kris requesting the list of the 17 players. Here is your list Kris:

LaMarcus Alldridge C 36
Al Horford PF 17
Darrick Martin PG 38
Jordan Farmar PG 21
Ronnie Price PG 16
Josh Howard SF 47
Keith Bogans SF 28
Jeff Green SF 19
Michael Redd SG 57
Ray Allen SG 54
Eddie House SG 31
Dahntay Jones SG 26
Martell Webster SG 26
Von Wafer SG 9
DJ Strawberry SG 8
Mario West SG 7
Marco Belinelli SG 6

Chizat on January 15, 2008 said:

Well, you can expect Horford, Green, Strawberry, Belinelli and West to be off this list by then end of the year.

Kris

Tim Ormond on January 15, 2008 said:

Either that or they might establish a new career high the next time they play us. I think we face each one of those players at least one more time this year.

bob marley on January 15, 2008 said:

who cares? as long as the jazz win i dont care how many points these morons score.

Jeremy on January 15, 2008 said:

I have heard this too, and maybe because there are a few that are currently in the NBA right now. Prooves to be not the case necessarily. Everybody in the league at some point will shine against a team. Which team have Boozer, DWill, AK, Brewer, Okur, and Miles for example have been the recipient of the career highs of these guys? Thanks
Jeremy J

Josh on January 15, 2008 said:

Was Ronnie Price playing for the Jazz at the time?

Todd on January 15, 2008 said:

It looks like he scored 16 points twice, and (at least) one of those times was while with the Jazz.

Who in the world is Von Wafer?

Jon on January 15, 2008 said:

Josh, the list of 17 is those against the Jazz, so Ronnie Price did it while in Sacramento.

Tim, how do the numbers fall out if you only look at the players who have scored over 25? I think the rumor started because it is only noticeable for those players who score a large number of points. (in other words, no one is caring that Von Wafer (of the Nuggets) has a career high of 9 when he averages garbage time).

Also, from that all-time team (which seems like only current players), which teams did they do that against?

Lumbar on January 15, 2008 said:

Well, all time statistics aren’t important, when the jazz were a good defensive team this never happened, 2 guards dropping bombs that is. So the stats need to show the this year and last because that is where this “myth” has began.

Jeff on January 15, 2008 said:

Yo Josh, Ronnie Price was with the Sacramento Kings when he scored his career high 16 points. That was the game last year when he had a monster dunk over Carlos Boozer.

And of course he wasn’t with the Jazz at the time! How do you get a career high against your own team?

Phil on January 16, 2008 said:

i wondering what are the career highs of the jazz players against other teams

Boris on January 16, 2008 said:

If Ronnie Brewer and the others learn to defend the perimeter, players like Ray Allen, Kobe Bryant, Manu Ginobili, Gilbert Arenas, Michael Redd and so on…won’t scorch the Jazz more often than they scorch other teams.

And I also have the feeling that players like Matt Bonner, Martell Webster and others, who don’t usually impress you with big scoring numbers, make big games against the Jazz. They are not necessarily career games, but high above average.

Stephen on January 16, 2008 said:

@ Jeremy J

Career highs and teams

Boozer 41 vs. Washington
DWill 41 vs. Dallas
AK 31 vs. Miami
Brewer 21 vs. Phoenix
Okur 38 vs. Washington

for closer look: nba.com

Stephen

Sergio on January 16, 2008 said:

It’s funny how in the whole NBA environment every season there’s something to be said about the Jazz. When you look at the daily highlights on NBA.com even the commentators give the impression that they don’t consider the Jazz a strong contender in the West. Recently, with the win against Phoenix the headline read something like: Jazz beat the shorthanded Suns, and although true, I bet a million bucks that if it was Portland or Boston the story would’ve been different. Same thing last year, the Jazz made it to the Western Conference finals beating Houston and the Warriors, but the story was about Golden State upsetting the Mavs, I really never heard anyone giving the Jazz the credit they deserved for the great improvement they made compared to the previous season. In the end, being a Jazz fan I always enjoy proving the critics wrong, it makes the Jazz’s achievements even more meaningful. That an individual player scored career-highs against the Jazz, so what? When Ronnie Price scored his career-high last season with Sacramento nobody is saying anything about that come back win the Jazz pulled off that night (as a team I might add.) When Redd scored his 57, the Jazz still beat the Bucks, and when Josh Howard got his 47, nobody is saying anything about Deron scoring his career-high 41 that same night. Yes, the Jazz might have some defensive deficiencies right now, but I believe that with the Kyle Korver move, the great improvements made by rookies C.J Miles and Ronnie Brewer, the Jazz are gradually getting back on track defensively. Boozer is a monster in rebounding and scoring, Kirilenko a great blocker and a play-maker and DWill, well, He’s DWill, versatile in every aspect of the game. Think about DWill and Chris Paul for a sec, who’s getting the most hype from the media for the all-star voting? This would be another great myth-busting mission for our friend Tim Ormond. What do you think Tim?
Myth: Jazz were fools for picking DWill over CP3 in the draft
Do you believe that CP3 would’ve fit-in better than DWill at the point-guard position?

Chizat on January 16, 2008 said:

“Well, all time statistics aren’t important, when the jazz were a good defensive team this never happened, 2 guards dropping bombs that is. So the stats need to show the this year and last because that is where this “myth” has began.”

When where the Jazz the type of team that didn’t let 2 guards “drop bombs” on us? Even when they went to the finals, they let a certain 2-guard drop a few.

It annoys me so bad when idiots think the past Jazz teams were perfect, and the current Jazz team is so flawed. Yeah, we were much better off defensively when we had a slow, un-athletic 6′ 3″ defender at the 2-guard position.

Tim Ormond on January 16, 2008 said:

Ok…..I didn’t look at this for a few hours and quite a few comments popped up. Thanks to all who posted here I will now try to answer all of your questions.

First, let me give you come additional information.

The list I composed was of the 429 players listed on NBA.com, so basically it is active players.

@ Jon

The numbers don’t change that much when you look only at the players who have scored more than 25 points. 258 of the 429 player or 60% of the league has a career high over 25 points. The teams that have given up the most 25+ career high games to active players are in order:

5- Miami/Seattle with 11 players
4- Goldent State/LA Lakers/Orlando with 12 players
3- Washington with 16 players
2- Phoenix with 17 players
1- Milwaukee with 18 players

At the bottom of the list is New Orleans with 2 players.

So a little change but not a lot.

Also, from the all-time team (which really should be title all active team) If you click on their name in the post I linked Youtube.com footage of their career high games.

@ Phil

Here is the list of Jazz career highs:

Almond 2 pts
Boozer 41 pts
Brewer 21 pts
Collins 22 pts
Fess 6 pts
Harp 33 pts
Hart 21 pts
AK 31 pts
Korver 31 pts
CJ 23 pts
Milsap 28 pts
Memo 38 pts
Price 16 pts
DWill 41 pts

Anything else you all want to know, just ask and I’ll see what I can find for you.

Tim Ormond on January 16, 2008 said:

@ Sergio

I can see your point. I do believe that the Jazz do not get as much credit as other teams in the league. But keep in mind even last year there were a few people in the media giving our team credit. Charles Barkley for one is always talking up the Jazz.

In response to your question to bust the Myth of DWill vs CP3, I will gladly take on this challenge. Although, I really feel that more time will have to pass before I make a final conclusion. My gut feeling at this point is that both players are great. The Jazz got who they wanted and I’m happy with the pick.

Jonathan on January 16, 2008 said:

I think the reason that we have gotten the impression that we have the most career highs against us, is because we don’t double team guards very often. This does allow the superstar 2 guards to sometimes have a big night, however, if we are containing the rest of the team and get a win, then I am all for it.

ben on January 16, 2008 said:

How many of these career highs were in a failing attempt in winning the game?

Linda McFarland on January 16, 2008 said:

For those of you who love stats. (Someone can really love stats?) I think this is a great job of looking them up. Stats are probably important but the one that makes sense to me is the win-lose stat. I care a lot more about how the players are working together, moving and sharing the ball, and seeming to enjoy what they are doing. I guess a stat for that would be pretty difficult.

Tim Ormond on January 16, 2008 said:

@Ben

I could work on that, but honestly it would take a long long time to figure that out. The only way I have to pull data is one player at a time. Then I would have to research the specific date they played to find our if the won or lost. Unfortunately I don’t have the time right now to provide you with that answer.

Jeremy j on January 16, 2008 said:

Stat:
Karl Malone
Career High Points: 61
vs Millwakee Bucks
01/27/1990

They won this game big time after Malone was dissed for not being put ahead of
A.C. Green (was it) for the (Lakers – Hollywood). It was his career high and they won. A lot of times the Jazz players througout history of you look will have a “W” behind a career night from someone. Not always. ie. DWill against the Mavs this season. But, in general. I am not all about stats for most points etc… The point is that the Jazz have one of the highest winning percentages in the last 20 years of all the NBA teams. We have done that without a superstar for the most part. Team ball. We just ran in MJ23 two years in a row unfortunately.

Jon on January 16, 2008 said:

Tim and Sergio,

In just the last week, I have seen D Will mentioned as the best player to bring the ball the length of the court at the end of a close game (TNT) and the Delta Center, err…ESA mentioned as one of the toughest arenas to play in (ESPN). so I think that there is an awareness of the Jazz by the national media, it’s just hard to mention them a lot when they are suffering through a December to forget.

Tim Ormond on January 16, 2008 said:

@ Jon

Good point Jon. I’ve noticed this as well. I think the media does give DWill some credit although not nearly as much as you see Chris Paul receive. And like it or not CP3 and DWill will always be linked, so in the minds of some complimenting Chris Paul is just like criticizing DWill. I don’t agree with that train of thought, but it’s just the way it is.

I will say this though, it is going to be very interesting to see who the coaches think is better when the All-Star selections come out.

Lumbar on January 16, 2008 said:

Hey Chizat, I’m not saying we are terrible now and were perfect then, but the myth is about the last 2 seasons, so u would have to show the stats from the start of last season and how many career highs have been set since then and what % the jazz have allowed is all I’m saying, i think it would be higher then where we rank on these stats shown. And when u say Jordan dropped bombs on us then too… he was the greatest player to ever live…. so maybe that is understandable?

Diana on January 17, 2008 said:

Thanks for this post. I find it interesting. I think most teams will think something is unique to their team, for example with shooting guards going off on the Jazz. Maybe teams that Jazz have had much success against always complain against power forwards or point guards going off against them.
I personally think this year the perimeter defense has been better than last year. I remember Josh Howard going off on us this year but that’s really all i can remember of a shoot guard killing us.

Phil on January 17, 2008 said:

Ronnie Brewer has improved alot this season but i have never seen a jazz game so am not sure wether he can be a lockdown 2 guard and be able to stop players like Redd . I think Utah made a good choice with D Will and he has shown he has had some great games against quality pg’s and he can handle the best.

dean on January 18, 2008 said:

well add linas kleiza to that list when jazz need a win desperatly they managed to allow him to go off for 41

Linda McFarland on January 18, 2008 said:

I don’t think anyone (even his team) knew he was up to that. It certainly took us off guard. It was not a shiny game for us through all 4 quarters but other than a much better defense showing by one certain player I don’t know what we could have done about Kleiza. He was playing out of his head and trying to make a statement to his coach since he had only been playing 18 minutes a game. Too bad it was us who got the blunt of it. He certainly made a atatement!!!!!

Jon on January 18, 2008 said:

Hmmm, Linda, do you mean Boozer? or Brewer? the truth is that entire team loafed around and didn’t get back to the other end. As usual the Jazz forgot how to defend on the road.

And he was supposedly playing Power forward, not the Small Forward/Shooting Guard….

Linda McFarland on January 18, 2008 said:

Jon….I really hate to name names because every player has his good parts and bad parts and good and bad games. None of us see the same thing in a game but I wanted to climb in the TV and make Ocur out his arms up in the air when on defense. Maybe get a foul but at least make it a little harder for the person to shoot.

C_bass on January 18, 2008 said:

My opinion on why we have guys having career nights playing against us and our current state of underperforming …
1.We do not have any sort of interior defense. Watching Booze and Okur play defense in the paint is like pulling teeth, they are softer than Charmin in the paint. Combined Boozer and Okur average .96 blocks per game. If Boozer wants to be recognized as a top tier power foward (i.e Duncan, Garnett, D. Howard) he needs to improve his defense.
2. Our guards are not developed enough to play NBA guards. What I mean by “not developed enough” is they are still young by the NBA standard, they need more experience playing against the top basketball players in the world.
3. The biggest problem with the jazz right now is the lack of solid team defense. They all seem way to concerned with sticking with their man that they don’t play help defense( with the exception being AK). They don’t have good communication on defense, for example the lack of communication coming off screens, causes wide open jump shots for the opposing team.
I don’t want this to sound way to negative about the jazz, because I still believe that they are conteders in the west, the offense is there, we can outscore anybody in the league with our athletic, inside/outside game. But if they want they want to get to the next level and start playing for some championships than they better start executing on defense.

sweet baby d on January 19, 2008 said:

you can add linas kleiza’s 41 points to the list now too.

clay on January 20, 2008 said:

Well I will take DWill and his health over Chris Paul and a possible injury everyday of the week. If we ran a system like the suns I would take Chris Paul and run the hell out of other teams. But in Jerry’s System I will take DWill and his cool head everynight of the week. To Diana and only being able to remember Josh Howard scorching us. I want to say Martell Webster came in and did it for a quarter then we let Travis Outlaw. I also want to say I hate Outlaw because he seems to always have a decent game against the Jazz. I got to say for Brewer being only a second year player he plays pretty good defense night in and night out against the other teams best player. I agree that Boozer and Okur are very week defenders and until atleast one of them gets better at it, that chip will elude us for a while. I also want to say what Kleiza did is pretty amazing but the guy can play. I have watched him over the last couple seasons and he is one of the better bench guys in the league. Plus he does what Okur does as a big man and stretches the Defense. So I give him all the credit for our loss the other night. I think for the All Star game if your going off numbers Chris Paul has earned it. But if your going off what guy deserves it, it might be a toss up. DWill has had alot of TO’s this year in games we needed him to be sharp. I havent seen alot of the Hornets games so I dont know exactly how Paul has performed at crunch time this year. But if I was going to give the last shot to either it would be DWill with that sweet step back. Paul is a great player and will go to the All Star game. Its in New Orleans so its almost a given. If the fans dont vote DWill in he isnt making it this year. But I think D taking a break that weekend is for the best. He has been playing basketball for two years straight with the USA team and stuff in the summers. So maybe this will give a little extra push on the snub and make him that much better in the 2nd half of the season. Lets GO JAZZ

opsrus on January 20, 2008 said:

after Kleiza’s performance this article looks ironic

Shortest but Biggest Jazz fan on January 20, 2008 said:

What clay said was so true. Besides, D Will has a chance to win a gold medal in the olympics and CP3 gets 30 seconds of fame playing in the allstar game. And if Jason kidd or billups gets injured [please be a knee injury] then d will will get back up minutes and be all over ESPN and more than likely be ten times better than he already was and will consistantly always be at the top of the list of the best point guards in the league.

Jeff on January 23, 2008 said:

Here is one possible “myth” I’d like you to look into. I hear lots of people talk about Coach Sloan restricting the number of 3-point attempts. I don’t think they lead the league by any means but it seems to me they attempt a decent number. Any thoughts?

B. Linder on January 29, 2008 said:

Sergio – I’m with you. It doesn’t matter if one player gets hot one night, as long as we still win. I was at that come back game last year in Sacto and it was great, regardless of one opponent’s stats. However, I have noticed this year that the Jazz tend to make a horrible defensive showing against the teams that have a “shooting star,” the Bryant’s and Jameses of the world, for instance. I have basically contributed it to the youth and relative inexperience of this team but at times have noticed a reluctance to change up the defense when one guy is killing us. Staying with a game plan is one thing but refusing to adapt to shut a guy down who’s hitting us for 30, 40 or more points is ridiculous.